More info about Fred Hanna

Here follows an email exchange with Mike Duff, the great-nephew of Fred Hanna:

 

 

Email: 25/06/2014 15:17: Mike Duff: Subject: Family connection

Hello Richard,

This will likely seem like a very random question, but are you the son of Bernett Pender?

I'm asking having found this reference to Frederick Hanna on the BBC's WW1 memorial website:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/remembrance/wall/record/17068

Fred Hanna was my mother's uncle and we're obviously interested to know more about him. Google took me to an obituary for Bernett Pender and told me that he had a son called Richard. It's a sufficiently unusual name in Scotland that I then searched on your name and, on the basis of the Edinburgh connection, figured it was worth asking if you were indeed related.

If not, please disregard all of the above!

--

Best regards,

Mike

Reply: 25/06/2014 15:58: Richard Pender: Subject: Re: Family connection

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the email and for getting in touch.

I am indeed Richard Pender, son of Burnett Pender.

Isn't 'google' (or its equivalent) a great thing!

You asked about 'Fred Hanna' otherwise known in my father's family as 'Wee Hanna':

Dad died last year, but in his retirement, he had spent quite a lot of time with genealogy and 'family history' as a hobby.

I have put up most of his research on a web-site here:

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/

Of interest to you is probably the part 'John Pender's War' here:

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/history/john-penders-war/

where Fred Hanna is mentioned. Both my grandfather John Pender (my father's father) and Fred Hanna were mates in the Queens Own Cameron Highlanders in World War I, working as signallers, setting up and repairing communications links in the trenches and in no-man's land.

As you know from the story, Fred Hanna was sadly killed in action. From Dad's story I believe it was 31st of July 1917 at the third battle of Ypres (Also known as the Battle of Passchendaele).

As this was obviously an important family story, I think Dad must have also put up the story and photo on the BBC WW1 memorial site. Dad also made several trips to the battlefields of Flanders/France and was able to locate Hanna's name on the great Menin Gate Memorial at Ypres:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menin_Gate

We do have a picture of Fred Hanna in his highlander uniform here:

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/data/uploads/photos/pender-hanna-geyer.jpg

and

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/photo-gallery/#!prettyPhoto[pender-family-photo-gallery]/91/

If you are interested, I can search for the original scan to provide you this with the best resolution photo that I have.

Thanks again for getting in contact. If I can help with any other information, then please contact me again.

P.S. I can't tell from your email address, so I would be interested to know where you are based - UK, USA, Australia, somewhere else?

--

Kind regards,

Richard Pender

Reply: 25/06/2014 23:20: Richard Pender: Subject: Re: Family connection

Hello Mike,

Some more information about Frederick Hanna from web-searching this evening:

1) Lance Corporal Frederick Hanna, "C" Company, 6th Battalion

Cameron Highlanders is commemorated on the Menin Gate, on Panel 38 and 40.

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/908780/HANNA,%20FREDERICK%20GEORGE

http://www.twgpp.org/information.php?id=3718533

It is my understanding that the Menin Gate is a memorial to the 55000+ soldiers who were killed in the Ypres Salient of World War I and whose actual graves are unknown.

2) From the above link, it appears that F. Hanna was awarded the Military Medal (M M)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_Medal

This medal is awarded for 'acts of gallantry and devotion to duty under fire'.

3) I downloaded his Medal card from the National Archives (attached: top right on PDF) which indicates that he has a Military Medal, but gives no further information.

4) Medal awards were listed in the London Gazette, and from there I was able to find out that that the medal was awarded by the King and announced on 16th November 1916 (i.e. for an act of bravery some 1 year before his death).

Here are links to the relevant pages:

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29827/supplement/11137

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29827/supplement/11138

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29827/supplement/11139

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29827/supplement/11140

It is listed about 45% down the left hand column: S/11570Pte.F.G.Hanna,Cam'nHighrs

Somewhere, in the British Army archives it must have been listed where/when/what-for this award was made and it would be fascinating to know this. However, it is also may be that this information is no longer available - Dad said that when he was trying to find out information about my maternal grandfather that he was told that a significant part of the army service records were lost due to bombing of London in WWII.

5) From the Commonwealth War Graves commission web-site, the following additional information is given: Son of William John and Katherine Hanna, of 13, Bilsland Drive, Maryhill, Glasgow.

6) I also found this reference to a gravestone in the Glasgow Western Necropolis:

http://www.twgpp.org/information.php?id=3969397

I don't know, but I assume that this is the Hanna family grave, on which his name is also marked. Unfortunately, I don't find a reference marking where the grave is in the graveyard. If you find out where this gravestone is, I would be interested to know, so that one day I can seek it out.

Anyway, I hope that this information is interesting to you, and especially hope that it all ties in with your 'Frederick Hanna'.

--

Kind regards,

Richard Pender

Email : 26/06/2014 11:27: Mike Duff: Subject: Re: Family connection

 

Hi Richard,

Thanks for such a comprehensive response. I'm glad to find the 'right' Pender family, although I'm obviously sorry that your father is no longer with us as he obviously had a huge interest in the story.

I've shared your email with my mother, who was Fred Hanna's niece (although she was born 27 years after he died) and she has forwarded me scans of three photographs. That obviously makes him my great uncle. He was in the 6th battalion of the Cameron Highlanders and his date of joining and date of death both match.

Fascinatingly, this photograph  seems to have been taken on the same day and same location as this image: http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/photo-gallery/#!prettyPhoto[pender-family-photo-gallery]/108/ (which your father thought was in or near Basingstoke.) My mother says the picture was taken in 1914 during basic training. Figures in both are wearing the same dress uniforms and it is clearly a freshly-built camp (we may even have one man in both photographs - then man lying on the ground next to your grandfather may well be the one sitting on the right in this group.)

Which proves there's a fairly close connection!

Now the strange news - the Hanna in your pictures isn't 'our' Fred Hanna. My great uncle is the man sitting in the middle of our picture.

(And it's definitely him - this is a picture of him as a child.)

Clearly a different man to the one identified as Hanna here (or even to the other seated man):

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/photo-gallery/#!prettyPhoto[pender-family-photo-gallery]/91/

Which is an interesting confusion, to say the least. My mother said that 'our' Fred did win the military medal, and did die in July 1917 (she still has a notification postcard send by the war office), and his parents (my mother's grandparents) were as listed on the Commonwealth War Graves website.

So it looks like some (entirely understandable) confusion has crept in during the last 97 years. And as 'our' Fred Hanna was of average (or even above average) height it's hard to see that he might have been known as 'Wee'.

Of course there might have been two Hannas in the same regiment, although Fred's date of death does tie in with your grandfather's story.

My grandmother (who died in 2000) was Fred's younger sister and had memories of him coming home on leave from the front, including one occasion when he brought a training (and hopefully inert) Mills Bomb. He was the oldest sibling in a large family (eight in total) and the only one who served in the first world war (indeed, his youngest brother was only just old enough to join the RAF in WW2.) His father was an Irishman from Dublin and his mother was from Yorkshire; I've asked my mother if Fred had any Liverpool connection (as mentioned in your grandfather's account of the war.)

Regardless of everything, it's clear they served together. I'm just sorry we didn't get the chance to tell your father about the connection.

I live in Oxfordshire but my parents live in North Berwick - I take it from your email address that you're based in Switzerland?

And many thanks for such a comprehensive response.

Best regards,

Mike

Attachment: 013 Fred 1914 in training camp-2.jpeg

 

Attachment: 014 Fred close-up 2.JPG

 
 

Attachment: 008 Fred detail from family group 1907.JPG

 
 

Reply: 26/06/2014 23:06: Richard Pender: Subject: Re: Family connection

Hi Mike,

This is a very interesting story. It just goes to show that things you know to be true aren't always so. And as you say, it is a shame that my dad isn't around to join in the discussion.

I guess we have to think about what facts are the most certain and which could have become corrupted or misconstrued

1) We know John Pender was injured on 31/7/17 at 3rd Battle of Ypres., and we have the hospital redirection card notifying his mother of the injury: http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/photo-gallery/#!prettyPhoto[pender-family-photo-gallery]/47/

2) The story about Fred Hanna being sniped and killed also on 31st July fits well with your knowledge, and with the Commonwealth War Graves Commission information. This matches well with the story of my grandfather, so it seems reasonable that my grandfather and your great-uncle are the two actors in this play.

3) You can be quite sure what your relative looks like and it doesn't match the person marked on dad's photo as Hanna. I think it was my dad that marked the name as Hanna. Perhaps he misunderstood or just assumed that this picture that he had known since his childhood referred to the 'Hanna' of the stories he had heard. If he already thought he 'knew' this fact back in his childhood, then it would have been reinforced over time when he finally got round to doing some research. This is unfortunately something only dad or his father could have shed some more light on.

I live and work in Switzerland as a self-employed electronic engineer, but I go back to Edinburgh every two months or so to see my mother for a few days. When I am there next time I intend to have another look at the photos. Perhaps there is something written on the back of the Pender/Guyer/Hanna photo that may say something more.....

4) Concerning matching other names and faces between the photos, you obviously have a better eye for it than me. To be honest, I don't immediately make any convincing matches.....

5) I noticed that my father in the 'John Pender's War" story at first wrote the name as 'Hannah' in the story, and later as 'Hanna'. Perhaps my father originally assumed the name was 'Hannah' since he only heard it spoken, and later corrected it to 'Hanna' once he had done some research and found 'Hanna' but not 'Hannah' in the regimental lists.

My mother also said that she was familiar with the term 'Wee Hanna' which is how my father referred to 'Hanna'. I assume my father would only refer to him like that if he had heard his own father use it, but it doesn't give any clue to why.

Anyway, my mother was pleased to hear that some 'random' person had seen the web information and found something to interest them in the stuff dad had written up and that it linked with their story. My mother is not an internet user, she is somewhat amazed at the breadth of information and links that it throws up.

Thanks again. If anything else occurs to you then please do to hesitate get back in touch.

--

Kind regards,

Richard Pender

Email : 26/06/2014 11:38: Mike Duff : Subject: One more image

Hi Richard,

Sorry, I didn't attach the other photograph:

Our Fred is the man lying centre of frame; I can't see your grandfather in the image. I think we do have found somebody from both 'sides' though - then man standard fifth from the left on the back row looks very like the man standing fourth from the left in this image on your website:

http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/data/uploads/photos/mobile-infantry_fc.jpg

Attachment: 015 Fred signallers 6th batt Camerons-2.jpg

 
 

Attachment: 016 Detail of signallers photo-002.JPG

 
 

Email: 26/06/2014 11:42: Mike Duff: Subject: PS

Terry Hunt was a photographer in Basingstoke in period, so we've definitely cleared up where these early pictures were taken.

http://www3.hants.gov.uk/willis-museum/local-studies-willis/basingstoke-then.htm

Email: 26/06/2014 11:50: Mike Duff: Subject: PPS

How did we manage anything without Google?

here's another image from Basingstoke, with the same 'mascot' from the Signallers picture:

http://www3.hants.gov.uk/willis-museum/local-studies-willis/basingstoke-then.htm

And here's a more general history of the battalion’s move to the front:

http://special.lib.gla.ac.uk/exhibns/month/sep2005.html

Email: 29/06/2014 22:26: Mike Duff: Subject: Fwd Fred

Hi Richard,

I got this from my mother, which clears up enough loose ends to make me certain that we are talking about the same Fred Hanna. Clearly at some point his name became associated with whoever it is in the photograph (which is understandable enough over 95 years), but it is clearly the same man.

It's strangely comforting to know that he was remembered elsewhere, and that he died while trying to help a comrade who then survived the war and had a family. It is a great shame that he does not have a grave, but in that he is hardly alone.

Thanks for everything you sent through.

--

Cheers,

Mike

 

Begin forwarded message:

Yes, Fred was born in Liverpool. His parents were married there in 1895 and Fred (1896), Emily and Willie were born there. They moved to Glasgow before June 1907 where Mother was born.

 The family photo taken in the summer of 1907 shows Fred to have been very small for an 11 year old.  This is based on a comparison of Freds' height with his father's and his mother's height with his father's (in a pic taken on the same day)  My grandmother was maybe 5 ft. so he may have been Wee Hanna.

The photo of the group not in uniform was said to have been taken in Aldershot and the uniforms were supposedly bandsmens', all that was available.

The group of signallers does certainly appear to have the same mascot.

I have couple of newspaper cuttings listing awards of the Military Medal but they are undated, and an in memoriem notice from the Glasgow Evening Times from July 31 1919. I wonder if there is an archive anywhere of medal citations? It was also said that Fred was mentioned in despatches after his death, if true, then presumably for going to try to help his comrade when under fire from the sniper. Since Mother was only 10 when Fred died my information is from what she was told later, but may be the best available.

I have also got some notes which I took from the regimental magazine in the Mitchell Library and will look for the version on the computer and let you have it.  By 1917 the magazine had become very scrappy and does not even mention Ypres, but does briefly describe the earlier battle of Loos in which more than half the men were killed or wounded.

Email: 03/07/2014 16:32: Mike Duff: Subject: Basingstoke

Hi Richard,

After 20 minutes on Streetview I tracked down the location of the parade in Basingstoke, more out of interest than anything else.

You should be able to see it here:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.26383,-1.094272,3a,75y,355.44h,98.2t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1srpyOEyL2yzpYorG4fZVWMQ!2e0

(If that doesn't work it's the junction of Penrith Road and Worting Road).

The houses in the background are all still standing, although the waste ground behind the parade has long since been developed (indeed, 'Fox and Sons' - sign visible here - are still Basingstoke estate agents.

If the two photographs were taken on different days then it was obviously the location of a regular parade.

--

Best,

Mike

Attachment: http://www3.hants.gov.uk/1914loadimage.jpg?id=18197

 
 

Email: 28/06/2014 22:33: Cathleen Duff: Subject: Fred Hanna

Hello Richard,

I have got your address from my son, Mike.

When he found the bit on the BBC website and passed it on I was relieved to find that Fred had been killed cleanly by a sniper. The family story was that he had been killed mending telephone lines and had been mentioned in despatches. Families were not always told the truth when it would have been distressing, and I had wondered if he had actually died of wounds.

Everything in your email fits with what my mother, who was his sister, had told me, except that  the photograph is not of Fred. I will attach our photos, which belonged to his mother.

The first is of a group in training, said to be in Aldershot, wearing bandsmen's uniforms because of the shortage of the Cameron ones. There is an enlargement of Fred, who was only 18. The other group is obviously after training and has the little boy mascot who appears in one of your pictures.

Fred (Frederick George) was the eldest of a family of 6, the youngest being only a baby when he died. His father was from Dublin and his mother from Hull, though he had a Scottish grandmother. He was born in Liverpool in 1896 and the family moved to Glasgow in 1907. My mother, who was only 7 when Fred joined up, thought he had had some sort of office job but wasn't sure. She, like me, wished she had asked questions before it was too late. Her only vivid memory of him was that once when he was home on leave he entertained the children by tapping morse messages very rapidly on the kitchen table.

He was awarded the Military Medal, said to be for rescuing a wounded man from no-man's-land.

A few years ago I went through to Glasgow (we live in North Berwick) and read the regimental magazine for the relevant time. As the war progressed it became very scrappy and they could not keep up with medal awards or with fatalities, but there is a bit of information about the batallion's movements at the start of the war. I will forward my brief notes to you separately.

Cathleen

Attachment: 015 Fred signallers 6th batt Camerons-2.jpg

 
 

Attachment: 016 Detail of signallers photo-002.JPG

 
 

Reply: 30/06/2014 11:44: Richard Pender: Re: Fred Hanna

Dear Cathleen,

Many thanks for your email.

The story of Fred Hanna is fascinating showing the tremendous courage and comradeship of its time, yet, as with many such stories, it ends with tragedy.

I am very glad that the stuff that my father researched and I put up on the internet has found some resonance.

After Dad retired and the genealogy bug gripped him, Mum and Dad made several trips to the battlefields in Belgium. they specifically sought out Fred Hanna's name on the Menin Gate when at the memorial at Ypres, so he was not forgotten.

It was surprising and intriguing to both Mum and me that the picture that we know as 'Hanna' was actually of someone else, unfortunately now forgotten.

It just goes to show that over time things get 'half-remembered', and as we all now realise, (as Dad also realised from his own perspective), that the questions that could have cleared up the facts only occur to us after it is too late.

When I get a bit of time I will add something to the web page http://www.pender.ch/ancestry/history/john-penders-war/  to clarify what we have now found out.

Thanks for getting in touch, and best wishes to you and your family.

--

Kind regards,

Richard Pender

Reply : Re: Fred Hanna

One last thing for now:

While browsing on the web I managed to find a picture of Fred Hanna's name on the Menin Gate memorial. I have cleaned up the the photo and attached it to this email.

The photo came from this web-site:

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=Hanna&GSfn=Fred&GSbyrel=all&GSdy=1917&GSdyrel=in&GSob=n&GRid=12050633&df=all&

I hope it makes a nice addition to your scrap-book.

--

Kind regards,

Richard Pender

Attachment: 12050633_129797366091.jpg

 
 

Email: 20140703: Cathleen Duff: Subject: Fred Hanna2

Here are my notes from the regimental magazine.

--

Cathleen

 

Frederick George Hanna (1896-1917)

 Signaller, 10th Battalion, Cameron Highlanders

 

 

Notes from The 79th News     Mitchell Library     SRH PER 355 31 QUE

 

Vol 128 Oct 1914

Office opened on West George St.  Already recruited 600 men and 120 sent to Aldershot .  6th Service (ie wartime) Battalion formed 8 September 1914, commanded by Lieut Col A F. Douglas-Hamilton.  Serious training began in Rushmoor Camp in the middle of Sept.  Field training, entrenching and musketry. ‘weekly bathing parades and route marches were luxuries’  Moved to winter quarters (huts) on heights near Bramshott.

Vol 130 April 1915

Battalion moved to billets in Basingstoke, then on 27 Feb marched to Draycott near Swindon (took 2 days)

Vol 132 Oct 1915

A number of men listed as dying during training, mostly from measles.

4th July mobilisation orders received.  Whole company arrived overseas on 10th July.  11th Moved by train then marched to billets. 15th Marched to Wallon Cappell via St Omer(17 miles).  16th To Ham-en-Artois (12 miles).  Heavy rain all day.  Bivouaced all night in a field.  18th-20th In bivouac. 20th A and B companies sent to trenches for 48 hour instructional spell.  C and D companies in billets in La Beuvrier.  22nd A and B companies relieved by C and D companies.  23rd Whole Battalion moved to village behind firing line and billeted.  Period of trench digging etc.  Some shelling and some soldiers wounded.  10th to 18th Aug in trenches.

Uniform.  Khaki jacket and kilt with apron in front for marching and trenches (to be replaced when worn out by all-round apron).  Tam-o-Shanter on march and in trenches, Glengarry in billets.  Boots and khaki hosetops (knitted), putties, red garters.  Sporrans only for senior N.C.Os and above, to be provided by themselves, and worn in billets.  Smoke-helmet and respirator.  Pack with mess-tin hanging below and waterproof sheet on top.

Vol 133 Jan 1916.

6th Battalion played a brilliant part in the recent fighting at Loos on the 15-26 Sept 1915 and lost their gallant Commanding Officer in the final charge.

Long casualty lists for several battalions.

15th Highland Division advanced 2.5 miles to Hill 70 and charged over the top.

6th Battalion notes.  

Returned to Reserve on Sep 28 1915.  Reorganised and many new men.  By Oct 15th supplying working parties.  19th Took over support trenches.  20th Heavy shelling.  22nd Front line trenches.  26th Relieved but trench digging at night.  New trenches very muddy.  Nov 4th Back in  front line trenches.  7th Nov Moved back.  10th Returned to front line trenches.  Heavily shelled.  13th Relieved and bussed to Noeux-les-Mines.  13th-19th Resting.  19th-21st In reserve in billets.  21st Back in front line trenches.  Quiet.  24th Relieved then returned to trenches on 26th.  29th Relieved then to billets in Noyelles.  Dec 1st marched to Vaudricourt and billeted.

Vol 134 April 1916

Dec to Feb was the first long period of ordinary trench warfare spent by the battalion in France.  Out of the trenches for Christmas and New Year.  Had a week in December in the Hohenzollern Redoubt – ‘the constant shelling and quagmire of trenches was alone worth a long period of quiet’.

Lillers was the habitation of the 45th Brigade during the period of rest..  There was less to do than in any other town of comparable size encountered in France.  No theatres, picture houses and practically no recreation rooms.  Amusements were organised within the battalion.  There was a platoon football competition.  A match between officers and sergeants in the mud on Christmas Day.  Concert in early January.  Relieved the 1st Division in Jan and have had 2 long spells in the trenches.  First spell in good weather and boarded trenches.

6th Battalion Notes

1915 Dec 1st-6th Billets in Vaudricourt.  6th marched to Sailly-Labourse and billeted.  7th Front line trenches at Hohenzollern Redoubt.  9th Relieved and retired to support.  Working parties.  11th Back to front line.  Heavy shelling.  Trenches waist-deep in mud.  13th Relieved and to Sailly-Labourse and billeted.  15th Relieved and to rest billets in Lillers.  (marched to Noeux-les-Mines and to Lillers by train).  Dec 15th to Jan 14th 1916  Rest billets.  Training and manoeuvres.  Jan 14th moved to Loos Sector, train to Noeux-les-Mines, 14th - 20th in billets.  20th To front line trenches.  23rd Relieved.  Billets in Philosophe.  26th returned to front line.  27th Heavy shelling.  Stood to arms but attack was in adjoining area.  18th Heavy bombardment and mine exploded. (Had previously suspected mine’s presence)  29th Relieved.  To reserve trenches.  29th-Feb 1st  3 quiet days in reserve trenches.  Feb 1st Relieved, marched to Mazingarbe.  1st-7th In billets.  Village shelled but no casualties.  7th -10th took over front line trenches at centre of Puits XIV.  Battalion headquarters in a cellar in Loos.  10th-13th Back to Philosophe.  Billeted, working parties.  19th Relieved to Noeux-les-Mines for rest billets for 6 days.

N.B. Camerons were part of 15th (Scottish) Division.

Vol 135 July 191 6

Reference to Battle of Loos.  Wind changed and blew gas back towards lines and men gassed.  Wire uncut despite barrage.

Mr Churchill referred to ‘Scotland’s premier Division --- Out of 9,500 with whom it went into the engagement 6,000 were killed or wounded.’

Introduction of Military Medal announced.

Had been decided that publishing detailed notes of movements and actions of troops might be helpful to the enemy so in future there will be a 6 month delay before publishing details of actions.  In fact there were no further references to any movements or actions at all.  The magazine becomes largely lists of casualties, often well past the date at which they occurred, and obituaries of officers.

Vol 137 Jan 1917

Military Medals.  List of recipients including F.G.Hanna S/11570.  No longer any details of why M.M.s awarded,

Vol 141 Jan 1917

Killed in action L/Corporal F.Hana (sic)

 

My recollection is that Mother said that Fred was awarded the MM for rescuing his sergeant from no-man’s-land, and that at Ypres he had volunteered to repair communication lines when he was killed and that he was mentioned in despatches.  Not able to confirm.

The bound volume of the magazine went up to Oct 1918 but there was no reference at all to Ypres.

 

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